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Christians ignorant? What about Rasta's?!!
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Messian Dread
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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2004 17:36    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your only factual observation is the red-gold-green instead of other way around. Look to Africa, you see the tricolour in all forms. The combination of these three colour is what counts and they represent afrocentricity as opposed to eurocentricity in theology.

So you have no argument even when you provide examples because you can not come up with valid examples.

I observe, on the other hand, how you accuse Christian Rastafarians from stealing. I ask you: how can a Christian be accused of stealing Christianity. That is so absurd that it is very difficult to answer your questions as they can not be answered without pointing out to you how your mind set will lead you to asking these kind of questions.

When Selassie was asked how he felt about Rastafarians who believe him to be God, he did not only deny it. He said: "who am I to deny your faith?"

You are a teacher. Think about it.

And then go further and examine yourself.

Why are you using the Rastafarian colours symbolizing afrocentricity in theology where you show do not even recognize these crucial aspects in spite of your profession which does require a certain inteligence.
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Irie-in-Christ
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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2004 18:33    Post subject: Absurd? Reply with quote

In Rastafari it is especially Ethiopia that is important, because that's where ras tafari came from. So it's not just some kind of Afrocentricity. We were not talking about just plain Afrocentricity, because that will include a lot of people that don't have anything with Ethiopia or ras tafari. So when Rasta's use flags with Selassie together with flags that have the colours mixed up, who is ignorant? I mean, for Christians it is not a part of their own religion, but for Rasta it is. So that make it even more ignorant.

About the stealing thing: I was just talking in the same way some are talking on this forum. Christians are being accused of misuse and ignorance. And yes, sometimes they have a point. But to answer your question: first there was Judaism, then Christianity (or Messianic Judaism), and only much much later Rastafari. So my point was: if we talk about stealing, let's get things straight!

By the way, you've made your point clear that is very hard to answer all of my questions, because they all are so absurd. I guess I was just born very stupid, don't you think

Now if you want to talk about intelligence, here are some thoughts:

-exactly how intelligent is it to claim that when Jesus is called the Lion of Judah, to see in this a comparing to Ethiopian Emperors?

-and how intelligent is it to claim with certainty that Selassie and other emperors are true descendants of king Solomon?

Anyway, my point here is and was that your and others stories are too one sided, only focussing on the shortcomings of so called wannabee christians, and not mentioning the many shortcomings of Rasta.
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warthog
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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2004 19:58    Post subject: Reply with quote

IRIE-IN-X-RIST
wrote:->
and how intelligent is it to claim with certainty that Selassie and other emperors are true descendants of king Solomon?

TITUS 3:9 says :->But avoid foolish debates, genealogies, quarrels, and disputes about the law, for they are unprofitable and worthless

again to instill in your mind-set, we are ignorant of what our fellow man wants us to belief that doesnt mean we are ignorant of the word.

About the TRUE colors, for the period I have walked with the africans, you discover the colors on their flags share common meanings. As was in symbol since Marcus garvey. The red is for blood lost during colonialism, the green is for their land, the orange is one that may differ. I just wanted to let you know this colors dont represent your so called X-ristian ideology ethiopian-wise.

BLESS!!!!
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Messian Dread
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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2004 22:07    Post subject: Re: Absurd? Reply with quote

Irie-in-Christ wrote:
In Rastafari it is especially Ethiopia that is important, because that's where ras tafari came from.


No. Because Ethiopiah is the word used in the Bible for Africa.

Quote:
We were not talking about just plain Afrocentricity, because that will include a lot of people that don't have anything with Ethiopia or ras tafari.


Incorrect. Read again. "Afrocentricity in theology". Your argument also does not apply to the view of Rastafarians on Afrikan people.

Quote:
So when Rasta's use flags with Selassie together with flags that have the colours mixed up, who is ignorant?


People like you who see an inconsistency in that do. Because the colours do not mix up, they are being used in many african flags like red white blue is used in many babylonian flags.

Quote:
I mean, for Christians it is not a part of their own religion, but for Rasta it is. So that make it even more ignorant.


Until you can proof to me that Rastafari is a religion which you will have to do by giving me a definition of religion of which you will expose your ignorance on Rastafari as your definition of a religion will not apply to Rastafari, a sentence like that can not be taken seriously.

Quote:
About the stealing thing: I was just talking in the same way some are talking on this forum.


Ofcourse you are. But your participation goes no further then "don't say to your fellow that he can not tease because the other one teases too". What school do you teach on?

Quote:
And yes, sometimes they have a point. But to answer your question: first there was Judaism, then Christianity (or Messianic Judaism), and only much much later Rastafari. So my point was: if we talk about stealing, let's get things straight


All of your statements reveal that you view Rastafari as a religion like Christianity, Islam, Bushism, Bahai, Animism, whatever. I do not agree with that and will therefore no go along with you in your reasoning because then I will have to have the same mind set on Rastafari and I wish to combat that mind set as it is destructive.

Following this line, the ethiopian church was there before the european church so who's stealing? I say the people who use Rastafarian Symbology to act like Rastas to show Rastas that Rasta is wrong is an abominable practice and should be countered by all acceptable means.

The fact that I am a Christian gives me the right to adress these issues to my fellow Christians. All this so called argumentation you give me does not apply to me because I am a Christian and you can count on it that I stand symbol for many Rastafarians in this context.

Quote:
By the way, you've made your point clear that is very hard to answer all of my questions, because they all are so absurd. I guess I was just born very stupid, don't you think


I don't know. Maybe I'm born one-sided. I tried many times to explain things in a nutshell, I am in this posting doing that too. Why don't you try some arguments.

Quote:
-exactly how intelligent is it to claim that when Jesus is called the Lion of Judah, to see in this a comparing to Ethiopian Emperors?


As intelligent as is it to claim that when JAH is called the Father, to see in this a comparing to Fathers. Your only reason not to accept the principal as valid in the case of Lion of Judah where you see it valid in the case of "Father" and "King" is your eurocentricity which does only recognize those things which are recognized in eurism.

Quote:
-and how intelligent is it to claim with certainty that Selassie and other emperors are true descendants of king Solomon?


More inteligent then to claim that the askenazi jews descend from Jacob. More inteligent to claim that the Bible states Jah gave us babylon system eer "government" (Romans 13). More inteligent then to deny every spiritual significance with this man. Much more.

Quote:
Anyway, my point here is and was that your and others stories are too one sided, only focussing on the shortcomings of so called wannabee christians, and not mentioning the many shortcomings of Rasta


Don't you think that this is not overstood here and at the other places?

It's a bit useless to go to LOZ and talk about the wrongesses of anything but LOZ, don't you agree?

I know many Christafarians come here to "witness to Rastas" but this is ofcourse far from what is really going on.

It's a bit useless to adress critical remarks to Christians when there are no Christians around, don't you think?

Why don't you take that into consideration before you come on with a subject like this?

And why don't you ever explain why you constantly make a differentation between "christian" and "rasta"? I repeat:

The fact that I am a Christian gives me the right to adress these issues to my fellow Christians. All this so called argumentation you give me does not apply to me because I am a Christian and you can count on it that I stand symbol for many Rastafarians in this context.
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blaminack
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PostPosted: 04 Oct 2004 02:58    Post subject: Re: Absurd? Reply with quote

Quote:
It's a bit useless to adress critical remarks to Christians when there are no Christians around, don't you think?


Have you now become the judge of all? You see into and know the hearts of all men? This brings much discredit to you, sadly. Slandering those that should be your brother, is wrong. If they are not your brother then the godlly thing to do is to make the effort to make them your brother. Christ tells us to love our enemies. Is those how you do that?

Why?
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Messian Dread
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PostPosted: 04 Oct 2004 03:47    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you think that I state here that I believe there are no christians here?

Believe me, you got me wrong there (too).

Judging? Why am I not listed on your website which claims to have "all things christian and reggae" or something like that where you even have links on there to people who the description says you know nothing about? Not that I really care, but I have made that particular observation years ago allready and I thought it was kind of interesting to compare that with what you are doing here.

For the rest, if you think that the words which you used really justify a biblical description of one Christian adressing points of critique to another Christian in public, then explain to me the existance of a board where people are invited to speak their mind?

After all, good christians only obey authorities don't they.

And while you're at it, tell me how Paulus discredited himself by viciously slandering Peter when Paulus adressed critical remarks to his brother Peter, in public, calling him a hypocrite?

Why are you allways so focused on this? 80% of your responses are like the one here. Is it your job to tackle criticism about Christafari? Why does it get on your nerves when one Christian tells another Christian not to engage in hypocracy?
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blaminack
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PostPosted: 04 Oct 2004 04:26    Post subject: Reply with quote

For the record I no longer have the ability to update or edit that site. And it never said anything like all things Christian and Reggae. It was a presentation of Gospel Reggae which you have hundreds of times stated that you didn't want to be a part of.

I don't care about criticism, but I DO CARE about judging.

You were not saying that some one was engaging in hypocracy, you said that there are no real Chrisitans here.

Yes Paul confronted Peter for not being the same before all men, but explain how this applies to these that you say are not real Christians.

I also am noticing that you have been emphasizing that you are a Christian in your last few posts, when I have never seen you doing so before, what has changed? I am glad that you see Christ as your saviour. How are you helping others to do so? Particularly those that see the division that posts like your previous ones cause.
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Messian Dread
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PostPosted: 04 Oct 2004 14:33    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
You were not saying that some one was engaging in hypocracy, you said that there are no real Chrisitans here.


Either quote me on that or take it back for I have never said that. I have never stated that there are no Christians here. Quite the opposite. You really should take that back.

Quote:
I also am noticing that you have been emphasizing that you are a Christian in your last few posts, when I have never seen you doing so before, what has changed?


Could you tell me the difference between Messian and Christian? Yes, one is hebrew origin and the other greek. But both they mean the same. Messian Dread means Christian Dread.

Nothing has changed.

But when I critisize Christafarianism (let me call it that) I do so because I do not agree with my Christian Brethren.

That is why I said: "It is hard to critisize Christians when there are no Christians".

Or would you say I am not critisizing?

Is it then so difficult to conclude that I am not denying there are Christians here?

If I tell you I would'nt drive a car if there was not a road, and if I then start to drive, is there a road or is there no road?

Ofcourse I know that there is folks here who doubt if I am a Christian for they think you are either Christian or Rasta and when you are Christian you must tear down Rastafari. But that does not mean I agree with them.

If Christafari was not christian but something else would you really think I would spend one minute more here, trying to talk about what Yesus really ment?

Quote:
You were not saying that some one was engaging in hypocracy, you said that there are no real Chrisitans here.


That is really a spinned version of what I try to get across. I AM trying to get across that brethren in Kristos here are engaging in hypocrasy. That is my whole point. And that has been my point for years.

Why are you suprised that I state I am a Christian? Why do you think you have to describe that with the words "what has changed". Who's calling who a non-christian here.

I am born again on august 6, 1985. As I also state on my own website.


Quote:
I am glad that you see Christ as your saviour. How are you helping others to do so?


What a cheap remark. You're not really interested in that. You're not really asking it. You're trying to shut me down by wanting to say that Christafari is doing so much to "reach the unsaved" where I am only "causing division".

I'm not stupid.

Quote:
Particularly those that see the division that posts like your previous ones cause.


What division. You mean that I am not running along with Christafarianism? Indeed, although I am a Christian I am in no way a Christafarian. I think Christafarianism has nothing to do with Christianity as it is layed down in the Bible.

And I have arguments, documents, quotes.

So what is the division?

Division between who and why?

I see it often in the Christian World. People are too afraid to "question authority". They think it is unchristian to critisize someone. They think we must never disagree and we must if there is a disagreement put it under the table.

I do not think that the Bible tells us to behave like that.

I do not believe the Bible tells us to manipulate.

I do not believe the Bible tells us to stop thinking.

I do not believe the Bible tells us to "follow leaders" without questioning them.
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