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Haile Selassie: good or bad man?
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JonaGus
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Joined: 08 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 14 Oct 2004 23:35    Post subject: Reply with quote

warthog wrote:
OR LETS JUST SAY OUR LIMITED UNDERSTANDING OF THE YESHUAH & H.I.M.'s WORDs IS WHAT CAUSES CONFUSION?????


I do not believe that the apostles who knew Y'shua misunderstood him, nor that they passed erroneous information down to us. So inasmuch as his words and deeds are understandable, Christians have rightly understood them from the beginning.
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Do you remember when they crucified the Christ? There was someone on the left and someone on the right. They were both thieves! It's the same for ideologies. —Berhane Selassie
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warthog
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PostPosted: 15 Oct 2004 18:38    Post subject: Reply with quote

JONAGUS
do not believe that the apostles who knew Y'shua misunderstood him, nor that they passed erroneous information down to us. So inasmuch as his words and deeds are understandable, Christians have rightly understood them from the beginning.


YOU KNOW ITS FUNNY WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT UNDERSTANDING. CAUSE BELIEVE ME, THE CHRISTAFARIAN FAQ & SOME CHRISTIANS ACCUSE RASTAS SAYING "ASK EACH RASTA & HE WILL TELL YOU A DIFFERENT THING CONCERNING HIS FAITH"

BELIEVE ME ITS ONLY ON CHRISTAFARI & FROM YOUNG CHRISTIAN FANATICS THAT GIVE THE CHURCH CREDIT FOR TRUE COLORS( RED, GOLD & GREEN) & DREADLOCKS. MY CHRISTIAN CONSERVERTIVE FATHER WAS A STRONG WELL LEARNED THEOLOGIAN! CHURCH PASTOR!. HE WOULD ALWAYS FIGHT ME WHENEVER HE FOUND ME WITH TRUE COLORS OR WHENEVER I MISPLACED MY SCISSORS & COMB. I GUESS NOT EVERY CHRISTIAN UNDERSTANDS THE SAME.

BLESS!!!
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JonaGus
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PostPosted: 15 Oct 2004 19:20    Post subject: Reply with quote

warthog wrote:
THE CHRISTAFARIAN FAQ & SOME CHRISTIANS ACCUSE RASTAS SAYING "ASK EACH RASTA & HE WILL TELL YOU A DIFFERENT THING CONCERNING HIS FAITH"


I've never read the whole Christafari FAQ and do not care what Christafari or Mark Mohr say about Rastas. I'd rather learn from Rastas what they believe. And as I talk to them, they do believe different things.
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Do you remember when they crucified the Christ? There was someone on the left and someone on the right. They were both thieves! It's the same for ideologies. —Berhane Selassie
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Makheru8



Joined: 11 Oct 2004
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PostPosted: 17 Oct 2004 00:19    Post subject: Reply with quote

Peace and Love:

Jonagus: first oui did not know of your web page, nice work (oui were only asking). Oui have no cause against you -- oui just get a little passionate about oui ancestors and birthrights.

Oui did forget the Asian lion, oui tend to focus on origins and beginnings at times. However, If you tell oui that the lion you refer to is the Asian lion, then that is cool and when oui will speak of the "Lion of Judah" in future oui will say ambessa to clarify the distinction between the lion that oui use as a symbol and yours. All life are expressions of ideas when speaking of symbol, varying a little bit in character owed to the uniqueness in each of Jah 's creation. Lions are one of few living animals that have fossils that go back well over a million years. To the degree of evolution and seperation the Asian lion (panthera leo persica) is belived to have seperated from the Barbary lion as little as 100,000 years ago. Further the characteristics and traits of the animals are different, and as such their symbolic usage is too different. The characteristics of the lands and nature in which the two lived were very different. The Asian lion lived in a wooded enviornment, as such it could not be cumbered by a full mane -- it's "mane" is shaggy, the ears of the lion are even visible. They also has "tufts" of hair on thier elbows in both lions and lionesses. These animals have a lighter coat and mane, though rarely will develop a darker color. Asian lions grown in captivity will grow larger manes (away from woods)
http://www.asiatic-lion.org/species.html .
Ambessa(Nubian/Barbary Lion) (panthera leo leo -- King of Kings?)has a thick thick mane that extends down it's belly: the mane is dark except for around the face which is golden. Ambessa has shorter legs and a more muscular body than lions. Another difference is in the eyes, Ambessa has clear light eyes as opposed to the brown eyes that other lions have. Gazing into the sun.... but that carries other symbolism both ancient and modern that oui can't reason on here.
http://lionshrine.topcities.com/extinctlion.htm http://www.barbarylion.com/Article%202.htm http://users.aristotle.net/~swarmack/nslions.html.

There are other behavioral traits that could be reasoned upon.

From the most ancient times our people have used this symbol -- in Bes it was ntr as an "old man" lion-headed...the idea of the gentle sun as it goes down in the evening, the origins of even the Kemetic use is from equitorial Africa -- Sudan/Ethiopia , the old reflecting on the new. A cycle of rebirth that will never end. Bes was always portrayed with a full face, a unique representation in Kmt. The pygmies were regarded highly for their knowledge of "bes' dance"(southern origin).
http://www.touregypt.net/godsofegypt/bes.htm

Apedemak was discussed in a previous post, as the idea of the conquering and creative powers of light. Also recall the concept's triune nature, and that the was prominent we know in 1"bc"-20 "a.d.", as the idea was favored by Natakamani and Amanitore (just to indicate the idea was prevelant in the upper river).

Just for future reference when oui use Ambessa as a symbol -- it is with this history that is attached, even unto the sphinx that faces the east looking tward the sinai peninsula..the rising sun, procaliming the start of all time (zep tepi) But if a mane be a measure of "strength and might" then it is appropriate to both in a sense, where as Ambessa is the "lion" in it's full might and glory -- the Asian lion (not saying it is weaker on is symbol usage) shows one can we say deprived of their (mane)glory? -- it is overstood that this is situational. Also in case ones did not have time to read the links above, the "Nubian Lion" was kept in the private Royal collection in Ethiopia.... it was thought that they were extinct, a few others were found in a royal collection in Morrocco, efforts are being made to re-establish the species. So to that Jah Bless Sellassie I : Protector of Ambessa -- for without him the may have become extinct -- lost forever...among his "mistakes" oui have seen cited is feeding them. So for oui(personally) in the future oui speak of Ambessa as the "conquering lion" that was proclaimed from the ancient of days with the symbolism above attached.

Selassie I: Jonagus, as you feel you respect him, then oui will conclude that oui just did not overstand what you were saying...and apologize to you. To others oui ask:Is it respectful to deny a man his name? Or to deny HIM his fathers? Would respecting Haile Selassie require recognition of his names (and titles)?

Niguse Negest (King of Kings)
Atse (Emperor)
Seyoume Igziabiher Elect of God
Janhoy
Girmawi (Imperial Majesty).


Some may not approve of use of information not in the Bible, but oui thing is -- if it is true it measures but that is a matter of overstanding and not closing our ears to truth.
___________________________________________________________
Let's not forget that the ancient Israelites were certainly not Europeans, but dark skinned inhabitants, basically African Hebrew Israelites.

Who seh that Rastafari is derived from Judaism or Christianity? Rastafari ain't no religion but a spirituality unlike Judaism and Christianity, which are religions and history has proven that. Furthermore, both of these faiths were not founded by Israelites, they embraced the Messianic Faith.
_________________________________________________________
12tribeslion -- oui sight you on "overstanding". Thanks for the focus(spirituality).

It matters little though Jah is the destination on every road. With this oui will take depart. -- time for oui to go back to work.

In Peace,

Mac


Proverbs 22:1 A good name is rather to be chosen than great riches, and loving favor rather than silver and poor.

Proverbs 22:28 Remove not the ancient landmark which thy fathers have set.
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JonaGus
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PostPosted: 18 Oct 2004 18:11    Post subject: Reply with quote

Makheru8 wrote:
oui just get a little passionate about oui ancestors and birthrights.


Understandable.

Quote:
Selassie I: Jonagus, as you feel you respect him, then oui will conclude that oui just did not overstand what you were saying...and apologize to you.


I do believe he is a great and holy man, a worthy ikon of Y'shua HaMashiach whom he adored and served.

Quote:
Let's not forget that the ancient Israelites were certainly not Europeans, but dark skinned inhabitants, basically African Hebrew Israelites.


Of course they were not Europeans. They were Afro-Asiatics.

But, of course, all humans originated in Africa. Africa is our first home.

Quote:
Who seh that Rastafari is derived from Judaism or Christianity?


I do.
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Do you remember when they crucified the Christ? There was someone on the left and someone on the right. They were both thieves! It's the same for ideologies. —Berhane Selassie
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12TribesLion



Joined: 01 Oct 2002
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PostPosted: 21 Oct 2004 03:42    Post subject: Reply with quote

Believe whatever you want jonagus, me ain't wasting my time arguing with you. Because Rastafari ain't derive from no Judaism or Christianity. Dem is pure religion, I n I deal with spirituality. Rastafari is from Creation, always was and always will be.
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12TribesLion



Joined: 01 Oct 2002
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PostPosted: 21 Oct 2004 03:44    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another thing you need to know is that it is Rastafari not Rastafarianism. We don't deal with no isms or schisms.
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JonaGus
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PostPosted: 21 Oct 2004 17:43    Post subject: Reply with quote

12TribesLion wrote:
Rastafari ain't derive from no Judaism or Christianity.


If Rastafari wasn't derived from Judaism & Christianity, Rastas would not use Jewish & Christian scriptures, terms, and imagery, nor would they so highly revere a devout Christian monarch of a historically Christian nation. But Rastafari is derived from Judaism & Christianity, and Rastas do those things. Just like Christianity is derived from Judaism and Buddhism is derived from Hinduism. Those are the roots. Haile Selassie himself said that one of the most pressing concerns of our age was the promotion of Christianity.

This is not an insult or a disrespect to Rastas or to their religions in any way. "Derivation" is not a bad thing: I have a very high regard for Buddhism and Rastafari, and I am a Christian. While some may see Rastafari as a crazy and even defective offshoot, you may see it as the fulfillment toward which the whole was striving. (I don't take either of these extreme myself.) But regardless how you view it, derivation just means that no matter how deep the roots go, and no matter how true the branch is to the roots, the branch is still relatively new and unquestionably dependent.

And though you may wish to deny that Rastafari is an "ism" or "schism," it is, in reality, more than one "ism" by itself. Survey the doctrines of different Rastas and you find that Rastafari is clearly more than one religion.
_________________
Do you remember when they crucified the Christ? There was someone on the left and someone on the right. They were both thieves! It's the same for ideologies. —Berhane Selassie
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