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The Christafari Doctrine....
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Messian Dread
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Joined: 27 Jul 2002
Posts: 1085
Location: Fryslân

PostPosted: 18 May 2004 11:42    Post subject: The Christafari Doctrine.... Reply with quote

This posting is an expression of genuine thoughts and critique with the purpose of trying to make debatable what in the minds of many may not seem so important, but has a lot of relevance nevertheless.

This posting may sound "negative" and you can easily think of other words which are used to legitimatize a censorship. It might go in-depth, and before overstanding is reached it might be so that things have to be discussed which in the eyes of some are not to be used among people who follow JAH.

But you see in the Bible too, that people debate and debate deep. You see Paulus who publically told Peter that he was a hypocrite. You have Yesus Who in His Holy Anger wiped away the traders in -what was then still- JAH's temple.

You see also in the writings of Christafari, that reasoning is a very important part in the culture called Rastafari, a culture of which it is said that Christafari wants to have contact with members off. This reasoning is however impossible when there are "moderators", or better: "censorators" who are unaware of this and label every critique as "negative", or "unbiblical" and all that.

Added to that, there are also provocateurs who are aiming at taking every discussion or debate away from the topic and put it in a bad vibe, an unconstructive vibe. But these are easily recognized.

So it is my proposal to discuss the topics raised in this posting, in a mutual acknowledgment of each other's right to free speech and a mutual acknowledgment to stay on-topic.

It is not "workable" to have a discussion when there are censorators watching who are unable to overstand the words and in some kind of power-trip change postings or delete them. This will definitely end the discussion and will as a result of that only confirm the impression that many have.

When I write "Christafari", I am writing about the "entity" so to speak that is the subject of the Christafari.com website. Christafari, Lion Of Zion, is the name of what is called a "ministry". So an "official Christafari point of view" is for example an opinnion written down in the Christafari FAQ.

When I write Mark Mohr, I am referring to the founder of the "Christafari Ministry".

When I write about "Christafarians", I am refering to those people who are interested in Reggae, Dreads and so on, and get their main information from Christafari, who they see as the "Christian Authority on Rastafari". Usually, Christafarians are Christians who also dwell within the Christian Culture.

Now, after having said this, let's go over to the topic. I hope that this will go in-depth, I hope that many aspects will be covered, I hope that this will result in an edifying, clarifying situation.

Let's start off with some "overall" points of critique. It is then more easy to discuss certain details of this all.....

I will do so in a reply to this posting, just for the sake of clarity.
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The Issue: http://www.dubroom.org/christafari
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blaminack
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Joined: 15 Nov 2001
Posts: 1928
Location: Panama City Fl

PostPosted: 18 May 2004 12:25    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jetze just by trying to SPIN the job of the moderator into a negative thing for the purposes of saying what ever you want is wrong.

You think that calling me a censorator would keep me from deleting posts that need to be deleted will not work. I have deleted maybe 6-7 posts in the entire time that I have been a moderator. After having read literally thousands I would hardly call that a power trip or censorship. The ONLY reason anything gets deleted is abuse of the Rules of the Forum. Your Forum has rules I am sure. I am also sure that along the line some where you have had to delete some posts, close threads or let people know they were way off topic.

Now to the "Christafari" definition that you gave, I suppose there are some that think the way that you describe, but I don't know any. Most of the folks that post here regularly are quite informed on the subject but just have differant perspectives from yours. That seems to bother you and invoke a condescending "rebuke".

Censorship works both ways. It is only prevented whne both sides have respect for the views and ideas of the other.

Now let your "critique" begin. I will listen to see if there is anything to be learned.
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Admin
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Joined: 05 Nov 2001
Posts: 279
Location: Los Angeles, CA

PostPosted: 18 May 2004 14:55    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not even sure what the question was after reading that post so I am going to just leave a brief comment. I spoke much but never got to the critique. I don't know if this post is off-topic yet because I'm not sure what aspect of Christafari you are goign to comment on. It may better be placed in Christafari or Opinions instead of Rasta Reasoning.

On your comment about "right of free speech" - no civilization in the world has it. They all call it 'freedom' and then place limits on it. This is in an effort to protect certain groups that can't usually protect themselves.

Likewise, our terms of use (which are posted in the Announcements section) make no guarantee of free speech on this board. Like any community we have the right to place boundaries on what we see and it is this way for many reasons. By your use of the board you have submitted yourself to these boundaries as stated in the terms of use -- the same way someone living in a town submits themselves to the local bylaws and the elected government. This is not a hard concept to understand as it is universal.

There has been VERY little post deleting in this forum but I have instructed the moderators to do more as we are straying from our purpose. Some people on this forum seem to be unable to carry on without constant observation. Anyone who violates the terms of service, or who we see getting out of line and debating apart from the Biblical model will have their posts deleted. As well, there will be a general "clean up" on the way in which non-beneficial posts will be removed. More on this later, but as you can see posting rubbish at this point will be of little use as it will be removed.

Now if you have any questions from the FAQ that you wanted to discuss, please post away....be aware that the post may be moved to 'Christafari' depending on the contente.
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ZIONSLAVE
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Joined: 12 Nov 2003
Posts: 124

PostPosted: 18 May 2004 15:13    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think this thread is long overdue. I think it is a mistake to go on the defensive so soon B. Censorship certainly is a very "touchy" subject. However, I would try to look at this as an opportunity to really make clear the Chrstifari reasonings for it. I have personally been a victim of this censorship on this sight as Im sure MD has. I also feel it is VERY misleading to say that you have only deleated 6 or 7 posts. I beg to differ.

Also, I believe that this thread will cover alot more ground than just the positives and negatives of the censorship issue.

Dread,

I wonder if you would consider making a "rule" for this thread that we not bring up the ganja issue as it has been thouroughly examined in the last few months. I think there is much ground to cover that could be considerably delayed by rehashing the subject. (no pun intended)

ALL,

Anyway, first of I will say that I would like to have Mr Mohr interact with us on this thread if that is at all possible. I think that this would really give us all a real feel for the overall vision of Christafari as of now.

One major thing that I personally am still undecided about is idea of the dreads in order to be "like" a rasta to help minister. I do not think it is wrong necessarily but would be interested in a more clarified version on the thinking about appearence to others from Rev. Mohrs point of view.

So maybe censorship and ministry vision could be good jumping off points for this thread??
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GFD DUB MUSIC
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Joined: 08 May 2004
Posts: 129
Location: Indianapolis

PostPosted: 18 May 2004 15:22    Post subject: Reply with quote

i am glad to see this post up a few days after i had mentioned this Overwhelming Fact on some other posts., ..everyone who is seeking out their faith should be able to ask any question about any part of the Bible and also be able to Have Answered with the Opinion of every believer to the best they are able to explain what the seeker is searching out. To Deny Man the Ability to search for the Truth is like waving a niCe Hot Meal under a Hungry man nose and saying you can't have none!...Remember Christ say's " Man Shall Not Live By Bread and Water Alone"... Spiritual Nutrition is just as important. To Some anytime anyone disagree's with them it is a offense,..i feel sorry for those people to say the least, to say the most i will say this...Truth is 1 and for all, if there are disagreements then it is not the Truth's Fault, it is merely that the Truth has yet to be Spoken because Truth is Non Partial and is for all...That is the Reason for Reasoning, to find the Truth and then to Glory within the Truth because it brings Freedom. to speak of Rastafari only clouds up the issues and brings nothing towards Christianity. Haile Selassie was a man just as you and me and thats like sitting around praising each other and worshipping each other because we Follow Jesus Christ. We Should All Focus on Christianity and the Words Of Jesus Christ Specific if we are to Search out the Truth of Christ. Haile Selassie tells us all the same thing, so there shouldnt even be debate on that, and to further this..even the name Christafari promotes name of Rastafari and makes it all a Fashion Game..with no disrespect to them members of the band or whatever..hope ya dont erase this post.......but, if i may continue...it's what i feelin seen? there is so much hidden racist mentality idea's coming from within this site its insane, so if i may be allowed via a non partial attitude towards the legends of this site, i shall come with the truth so far as i am allowed to reveal withing the Glory and Majesty of the Father Within and Above all of the same 1 in 3 3 in 1..I give thanks still...there is much to be reasoned about this Christafari/Rastafari talk and debate cause the Name is Christ.... enought of the mix up... 1 love for all
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GFD DUB MUSIC
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Joined: 08 May 2004
Posts: 129
Location: Indianapolis

PostPosted: 18 May 2004 15:37    Post subject: Reply with quote

"an agenda that has to silence the opposition isnt an agenda worth fighting for".... Quote from Ghettobooster, wise words
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blaminack
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Joined: 15 Nov 2001
Posts: 1928
Location: Panama City Fl

PostPosted: 18 May 2004 16:48    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zionslave,

I challenge you to give referance to ANY post of yours that I have deleted.

I am by no means on the defensive. I am clearing some things up. The ONLY posts that I have deleted have been duplicates and ones that TOTALLY offended the Spirit of the Guidelines laid out by the Board Admin.
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warrior
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Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 423
Location: Between Canaan and Egypt

PostPosted: 18 May 2004 17:09    Post subject: Reply with quote

MD,

What is YOUR definition of this verse?
I ask because it is what is clear about dreadlocks and witnessing to those with dreads. Paul makes it clear that it is what is done for the sake of the gospel. I know you have a "problem" with this from what I have read from some of your posts.

1 COR 9:22 To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all men so that by all possible means I might save some. 23 I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings.



MD
Quote:
This reasoning is however impossible when there are "moderators", or better: "censorators" who are unaware of this and label every critique as "negative", or "unbiblical" and all that.


Messian, are you saying that everything you post is biblically sound and has no personal opinion associated with it?

You are saying what is only an opinion , not fact. Unaware? What do you mean? The moderators (from what I see) are making sure there are no destructive, personal attacks on the ones who are posting here.

You seem also to generalize:
Quote:
and all that


and all that. This is a very general and selfish statement. What do you mean and all that? Is all that what YOU feel or what JAH word says?

Scripture is clear that if there are heresy and malicious talk then we (as believers) should have nothing to do with such things.

So who do you want to "regulate/moderate" this or any forum?
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Isaiah 2:5 O house of Jacob, come ye, and let us walk in the light of the LORD.
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