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The Christafari Doctrine....
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Messian Dread
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PostPosted: 25 May 2004 17:45    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is a great joy, to read how this discussion developes. In the start of the thread, many things had to be overcome. And still have to be. But it is good to see willingness to participate in an analysis.

I doubt personally whether it is "just" the symantics. The symantics is a symptom. It goes deeper. This can easily be seen when the question is asked: how can it be that an inteligent person does not oversee the problems coming from a lack of providing propper information on Rastafari?

I think, this is because of the power of the "Christianese Correctness", which is neccesary in order to be accepted in the Christian World.

Just bringing back into my mind, I do not remember whether it was in an interview or on the website (but I think an interview) in which Mark Mohr was interviewed for a Christian reading audience. In it he spoke on how he "used to be a Rasta" before he got born again in a Christian camp which he went to to please his parents. Is this correct, thus far? His "rastafariness" is then described by himself as (among others) being involved in like violence and hard drugs and thing. Obviously, these things have nothing to do with Rastafari. I know, I see the "dreadlocks" dealing cokane too. Are they Rasta? But on the other hand, this is how many see the Rastas in the Christian World.

I blame it on the culture. the Christian Culture of pastors, ministries, churches, you name it. I know that people have to get support from the churches and thing for various reasons I do not directly want to discuss. I blame this culture for not giving Mark Mohr the room and opportunity to check things out for himself. He has to have a certain stance, otherwise he will not be (in the way it is described here on the forum sometime ago) "thought off as a Christian".

Anyway, it's like "the christians" have to be convinced that the movement of Rastafari is something worthy to send missionairies too, so to speak.

And this all doesn't neccesarily have to be willingfully, or intended. The possibility is there, that the pressure of the culture has not left any room for development.
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mikeroots
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PostPosted: 25 May 2004 18:56    Post subject: Reply with quote

Indeed, it is a joy that such issues can be discussed. I think it's necessary actually.

As many have observed and commented, Mark's/Christafari's approach, presentation and viewpoint have changed. It's important to see this. These changes are not in any way to compromise the message of the gospel- that aspect hasn't changed at all.

We must remember that as Mark went to Biola (bible college) and was part of the Sanctuary (correct?) with Bob Beeman, I imagine that he was mentored. We must have people to follow as they follow Christ. Paul was a mentor to Timothy. Paul instilled this idea within us through his teachings- be an example. Christ did the same as He washed His disciples feet. He did it as an example that His disciples would humble themselves and serve one another in love.

I can tell you that I have also followed the example of others who were strong father figures in my life- who set solid, Christ-following examples for me. Then there have been times when I followed not so good examples, but praise the Lord, I got back on track. Now we've got to stay the course. Now, here's the thing- we all must grow, spread our wings and fly for ourselves. We are shaped and influenced to some degree by those whom we surround ourselves with or look towards for support and for learning. Parents are classic examples.

Each man must come into his own, that through the transformative process of the Spirit of JAH that he will become the man that He is shaping him to be.

I think of this verse:
"But the path of the just is as the shining light, that shineth more and more unto the perfect day." Proverbs 4:18

I also think of Paul saying that until that which is perfect is come, we see dimly as through a glass because we know in part and prophesy in part. We're all growing and the Father continues to do that work He began within us when we recieved His Son and He shall see that work to completion.

The trouble with being an artiste (or author, etc.) is that you document where you are at a point in time and it is frozen. It is a snapshot, depicting where you were then. Everyone should be given the right to adjust things as the Holy Spirit leads, as knowledge increases and experiences teach. Some out in the world may be shown they may not be correct or that whatever they believed is no longer true, yet out of pride they may refuse to let go of the viewpoint. We see that in politics all the time. Also, some are accused of flip-flopping (sometimes they do!) when they may just be making more of an informed choice about something. For example, why does someone necessarily have to hold to the same viewpoint they did 25-30 years ago?

Of course, we're talking from a Christian viewpoint- totally different. Christ never changes, but we do. We learn more, we grow more and it's a great thing. I'm not speaking for Mark in any of this, by the way. It's forseeable though, that some of the FAQ's could change some to reflect current viewpoints.

Excellent points from all. I appreciate the discussion.
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ZIONSLAVE
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PostPosted: 25 May 2004 19:18    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes. and also there is the thing that there hypocritical Christians,and then on the other hand you have a group of people that are collectively called rasta or call themselves rasta (wether they are or not) that make a point to call attention to the failures of Christians. It goes two ways.

In so many ways I feel that ther is a special thing about the ability to reason and meditate on different opinions and such. I think that the natural unity that Christianity and Rastafari share are equally special. The belief in the Holy word of God. The fear of the Head creator. The yearning for Zion land. The seperation from Babylon. etc. etc. etc....... there are hundreds mabey thousands of parallels. The fact is the two in thier truest and purest form are exactly the same thing. No diffrence whatsoever.

I believe in these last days that Jah is calling his sons and daughters to Unity and peace. However, we also are to be contiuously on gaurd for the enemy.

Now I also want to touch a little closer on this enigma "Christifari" . As Jetze has spoken it is a thing that is interesting and sometimes baffling. The thing about it is that there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that there
is somethings wrong with something about Christifari. But please show me a belief system that from origin has never made a mistake. It is easy to point fingers and say this is wrong because.....It is more difficult to say mabey "i do not know" I think that is where I stand on this issue. I do not know! I am hoping that mark can find the time in his busy schedule to participate in this thread with us. I believe from what I have heard that he has good motives. On the other hand I do see the point of view of some where it is not wrong to say that even the word "Christafari" could be a poor choice. I think this particular thread has the ability to be very helpful if we keep it in prayer and try to have a loving attitude about our reasonings, debates, disagreements, and so on..

The Lord can do more than we could ask or think. Mabey this could be a seed that could grow into a more understanding view on Christ and rasta.

One blood
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GFD DUB MUSIC
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PostPosted: 25 May 2004 20:05    Post subject: Reply with quote

Messian Dread wrote:
It is a great joy, to read how this discussion developes. In the start of the thread, many things had to be overcome. And still have to be. But it is good to see willingness to participate in an analysis.

I doubt personally whether it is "just" the symantics. The symantics is a symptom. It goes deeper. This can easily be seen when the question is asked: how can it be that an inteligent person does not oversee the problems coming from a lack of providing propper information on Rastafari?

I think, this is because of the power of the "Christianese Correctness", which is neccesary in order to be accepted in the Christian World.

Just bringing back into my mind, I do not remember whether it was in an interview or on the website (but I think an interview) in which Mark Mohr was interviewed for a Christian reading audience. In it he spoke on how he "used to be a Rasta" before he got born again in a Christian camp which he went to to please his parents. Is this correct, thus far? His "rastafariness" is then described by himself as (among others) being involved in like violence and hard drugs and thing. Obviously, these things have nothing to do with Rastafari. I know, I see the "dreadlocks" dealing cokane too. Are they Rasta? But on the other hand, this is how many see the Rastas in the Christian World.

I blame it on the culture. the Christian Culture of pastors, ministries, churches, you name it. I know that people have to get support from the churches and thing for various reasons I do not directly want to discuss. I blame this culture for not giving Mark Mohr the room and opportunity to check things out for himself. He has to have a certain stance, otherwise he will not be (in the way it is described here on the forum sometime ago) "thought off as a Christian".

Anyway, it's like "the christians" have to be convinced that the movement of Rastafari is something worthy to send missionairies too, so to speak.

And this all doesn't neccesarily have to be willingfully, or intended. The possibility is there, that the pressure of the culture has not left any room for development.


...................................................... The Christians are not the ones who need to be Convinced of a movement of Rastafari, to most Christians if you say Rastafari they will say huh?????? ...Haile Selassie does not have 1 Significant role in Christianity other then being a Christian like the rest of us, Shame on Christafari for Profiting off of the Misguidance of Many with your pop reggae.... Mark you say you was a Rasta untill you was Born again as a Christian but yet you Continue to Mix up the 2 Different Religions for Profit...

and Christ said " for what is it to Profit the World and Lose Your Soul? "

... it sounds to me like your doing just that Mark & followers..

(MATTHEW 24:4-5)

(4) Jesus answered: Watch out that no one deceives you. (5) For many will come in my name, claiming, I am the Christ, and they will deceive many.

(MATTHEW 24:23-27)

(23) At that time if anyone says to you, Look, here is the Christ! Or, There he is! Do not believe it. (24) For False Christ's and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive if possible even the elect.

MATTHEW 24:4-5)

(4) Jesus answered: Watch out that no one deceives you. (5) For many will come in my name, CLAIMING, I AM THE CHRIST, and they will deceive many.

............................ Why Don't you all Practice What You Preach Mark Since your Reborn and know the truth, or Shall you keep Rejecting the Words of Christ while being Such a Authority?



At that time if anyone says to you, Look, here is the Christ! Or, There he is! Do not believe it. (24) For False Christ's and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive if possible even the elect. <<<<< even the elect.



[/u]
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blaminack
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PostPosted: 25 May 2004 23:39    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jetze,

I believe that the interview that you were talking about was refering to Mark's searching, in his youth. Like the phases that he went through on his journy to to becoming a Christian. No Violence is not the way of most rastas but it is the way of Gangs that Mark was involved in before becoming Rasta. Hard Drugs were also part of that scene.


GFD,

The last post that you made shows very little understanding of the reality of things. Where is all the money that these Bredren are making? There are only a handful of Reggae Artists in the World that we could say are doing well off of their music. The statements about mixing Chrisitanity and Rasta teaching is way off as well. There only place that they come close are the parallels that True Chrisitanity has with Rasta teaching. I am still amazed that you are still saying they are doing this to make money... I cannot believe it.

I wish that I had a picture off their tour bus to post along side the tour bus of the Popular CCM Artists. Money... ha
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GFD DUB MUSIC
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PostPosted: 26 May 2004 01:04    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok...well you can go to the store and buy a christafari cd... i woulda thought they was making some money, but i can see where those who really know about reggae music wouldnt buy it in the 1st place because of the Obvious Hypocracy of it all.... after all, Rastafarianism is a Black Movement for the Black man...as Most Rasta's will tell you there is a abbreviation for Rasta and it is this... Righteous Africa Stand Tall Alone.
So when they see a bunch of White Men wearing Dreadlocks Mixing up the name of Jesus and Selassie i can see how Most take it as a Fashion Band and bypass it all together.... But Reggae, well thats just another type of Music, like Rock and Roll...same with dUb, you don't have to act like your all Dread Red X to to play or Promote good Music. But when Christafari decided to get all Bamboozled over Names, well it just goes to show ya how it can all end up..having to defend your Ignorance to anyone of Intelligence on the Subject Forever.
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coolpoete
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PostPosted: 26 May 2004 01:30    Post subject: Reply with quote

and it was going so well..

Quote:
after all, Rastafarianism is a Black Movement for the Black man
that shows how much you know about the movement. Nobody requires that you have to like Christafari or their music or beliefs but please, get your facts straight at least.
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ZIONSLAVE
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PostPosted: 26 May 2004 02:19    Post subject: Reply with quote

GFD,

It is obvious that your words come from a view point that is very off. Im pretty sure that even if you had a few valid points they have been overlooked because of your very tactless presentation of them. All in all though, I am starting to really even doubt that you know much (if anything) about Christafari. Even more than that I see that your view of Rastafari seems tainted and even jaded as well.

All,

As I said earlier this thread needs prayer and meditation.

PLEASE!!!

Lets all make an effort to pray about our postings here because of the subject matter.
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